I don't know if you've changed up your Substack or I'm just noticing it now, but you're really bringing a lot of value here. Thank you.
Apropos of nothing, I graduated in sociology from UC-Berkeley and one of our legendary faculty, Neil Smelser, had argued that the UC schools had no business providing lower division education and that all students should go to community colleges for two years then transfer to finish at a UC campus. That idea obviously never caught on, but it used to be that the UCs took a bunch of community college transfers. I hope it's still true.
Thank you! <doffs chapeau>. The blog started as a pandemic place to park my thoughts, but it is maturing a little beyond that I suppose. As to your point about colleges not providing lower-division education, I certainly agree with the spirit of the idea. You would know better than I, but it seems to me that a lot of universities have expanded their gen ed requirements, which are classes that are very community college-like in their nature. Rather than critique secondary schools for what matriculating students do or do not bring with them to college, perhaps it's time to just acknowledge explicitly what gen ed requirements say implicitly, which is that most kids are not fully prepared. And we might consider that there are multiple ways to fill that gap, including community college.
The way general education is/should be taught has been debated for a long time by people smarter and more invested than me. We're re-doing our divisional requirements at Wake Forest now trying to make them make sense to ourselves and our students. Not sure the juice will be worth the squeeze. Especially at a place like Wake Forest, but even Berkeley I would say, the students are there those first two years for much more than what they get out of their required courses. I think the model of providing ample places at the UC campuses for community college students who want to transfer is a fine compromise.
Great piece, John. I have two questions. Do high school attendance trends parallel the trends for community college attendance? Is funding for community colleges declining?
Hi Phil. I don't know the answer to your first question, but my guess from the data I've seen is that it does not. On funding, there once was a ton of community college funding, but it has expired. "The Trade Adjustment Assistance Community College and Career Training (TAACCCT) grant program provided capacity-building grants to community colleges and other postsecondary institutions. The U.S. Department of Labor (DOL) administered the program in partnership with the U.S. Department of Education between 2011 and 2018 through four rounds of grants, providing a total of $1.9 billion to 256 grantees, comprising 1,113 colleges in all 50 states, the District of Columbia, and Puerto Rico."
I don't know if you've changed up your Substack or I'm just noticing it now, but you're really bringing a lot of value here. Thank you.
Apropos of nothing, I graduated in sociology from UC-Berkeley and one of our legendary faculty, Neil Smelser, had argued that the UC schools had no business providing lower division education and that all students should go to community colleges for two years then transfer to finish at a UC campus. That idea obviously never caught on, but it used to be that the UCs took a bunch of community college transfers. I hope it's still true.
Thank you! <doffs chapeau>. The blog started as a pandemic place to park my thoughts, but it is maturing a little beyond that I suppose. As to your point about colleges not providing lower-division education, I certainly agree with the spirit of the idea. You would know better than I, but it seems to me that a lot of universities have expanded their gen ed requirements, which are classes that are very community college-like in their nature. Rather than critique secondary schools for what matriculating students do or do not bring with them to college, perhaps it's time to just acknowledge explicitly what gen ed requirements say implicitly, which is that most kids are not fully prepared. And we might consider that there are multiple ways to fill that gap, including community college.
Keep up the great work.
The way general education is/should be taught has been debated for a long time by people smarter and more invested than me. We're re-doing our divisional requirements at Wake Forest now trying to make them make sense to ourselves and our students. Not sure the juice will be worth the squeeze. Especially at a place like Wake Forest, but even Berkeley I would say, the students are there those first two years for much more than what they get out of their required courses. I think the model of providing ample places at the UC campuses for community college students who want to transfer is a fine compromise.
Great piece, John. I have two questions. Do high school attendance trends parallel the trends for community college attendance? Is funding for community colleges declining?
Hi Phil. I don't know the answer to your first question, but my guess from the data I've seen is that it does not. On funding, there once was a ton of community college funding, but it has expired. "The Trade Adjustment Assistance Community College and Career Training (TAACCCT) grant program provided capacity-building grants to community colleges and other postsecondary institutions. The U.S. Department of Labor (DOL) administered the program in partnership with the U.S. Department of Education between 2011 and 2018 through four rounds of grants, providing a total of $1.9 billion to 256 grantees, comprising 1,113 colleges in all 50 states, the District of Columbia, and Puerto Rico."
https://www.dol.gov/agencies/eta/skills-training-grants/community-colleges/evaluation Oddly, it coincides with a period of pretty dramatic enrollment declines. That suggests that money alone is not the answer to getting more people (appropriately) into community college.